But Information is not a product of time, but of thought. The Universe Has Always Existed As will be patently obvious to anyone who has read much of my blog, I am incredibly fascinated by the question of Time and the description of the universe’s history. (By the way, if there was noting, The correspondent’s particular thinking is a variation of a trend of thinking from Hobbes and Spinoza, down to the present. As we are time dependent I'll say it so: Once there was God and nothing else. Friends Who Liked This Quote. I don't want to be kneejerk defensive, and I freely admit to not being a mathematician, but perhaps the depth of your comment re misunderstanding may be a little over the top itself. CMI records your real name, email address, and country as a sign of good faith. material (we would say created) world only, but then at the same time, you have assumed the existence of God as a discrete entity within set theory—all for the purpose of You can sign in to give your opinion on the answer. Privacy Policy. Sign in. Just to reiterate: the universe (all matter/energy) cannot have always existed (been eternal) because of the Second Law of Thermodynamics. In General Relativity, the Big Bang is a spacetime singularity. I once heard it explained by  Ravi Zacharias . The universe must have had a beginning and such a beginning needs a sufficient cause that is non-material (in order to be self-existing/eternal). It’s like saying ‘I’ve disproved the existence of a transcendent God by assuming He is not transcendent’. as follows: Interesting; I would have defined the universe as ‘all the matter and energy that exists’—and materialists (which the majority of scientists are today, (If you haven’t received your first email within a few minutes, try checking your spam folder.). By submitting your comment you are agreeing to receive email updates from. This is certainly how science’s founding fathers regarded the universe; the total amount There’s a wealth of evidence that the Universe began in a Big Bang around 14 billion years ago. Let me put it another way. If Materialists are as secure in their beliefs as they claim to be, they should easily see off the Creationist counter view without resorting to any suppression, abuse or misrepresentation. The question, “could the universe have always existed?” is really asking, “can the universe take God’s place?” Rather than having a God that always existed, this idea holds to a universe that has always existed and, thus, replaces an eternal God with an eternal universe. :-). It is a form of argument from universal causation. I would like to pose a few questions to Ted G. Strange for an atheist to argue that "universe" is a good term for "all that exists", considering secular scientists have toyed around with so many ideas that say there could be other universes. assuming that which you claim to prove. For example, if you burn a log in the fire you get ash and heat. Share this quote: Like Quote. 2 shot, killed at Northern Calif. mall on Black Friday. That aside: the universe could not have always existed because that idea is in direct opposition to the Second Law of Thermodynamics. elements of the set.”), Assume a materialist were to discuss set theory with a Christian. The universe has always existed, hence, there is no point in time when it was created, either by a deity or by accident. If anything existed then some form of universe existed, therefore, a changing universe has always existed up to … God - eternal, non material, creator & 2. The whole group of universes, if there are indeed more than one, is commonly called the multiverse. Thank you Dr Wieland. Yet the Materialists continue to complain and protest about Creationism’s modest challenge, like an elephant panicking over the presence of a mouse. If it always existed then how did we arrive at the present? Just to reiterate: the universe (all matter/energy) cannot have always existed (been eternal) because of the Second Law of Thermodynamics. This may sound like the dumbest of questions, for we know our universe is all the matter and energy that inhabits space and time. I.e. And as pointed out, I would normally have no problem with Astronomy and Astrophysics Questions and Answers, The Genesis Academy: A 12-part teaching series on Genesis 1–11, The Bible declares: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. I apologize for my testiness. have it both ways. The materialists have no problem with it, because in their view, there is nothing outside of matter/energy. There is no way for a thing to happen before the first moment of Time, because things only happen within Time, and there is no Time which exists … Numbers, which are utilized as abstract representations of objects in the material world. strengthening the materialist maxim of ‘no God’—which if true, would make your assumption invalid in the first place. Despite being infinite in size our universe is cyclical and has always existed in one of four stages. The catch – according to astrophysicist Brian Koberlein – is that, without the singularity, this model predicts that the universe had no beginning. Then He decided to create, so he did. But we have a finite amount of usable energy. People always believe that everything has a beginning and an end... Everything starts from somewhere or something... Everything has walls... What if there are no walls? The path back in time cannot be extended beyond 13.7 billion years or so. (“A set is a gathering together into a whole of definite, distinct objects of our perception and of our thought—which are called Recommend to friends. A quick follow-up on my just-made feedback. But then if you walked a little further and saw a piece of paper lying on the ground and it says “Hello Ravi How are you? But we cannot assume responsibility for, nor be taken as endorsing in any way, any other content or links on any such site. materialists and non-materialists alike. According to the preceding definition, the age of the universe is just the largest possible value of time having elapsed on such a clock. There’s a wealth of evidence that the Universe began in a Big Bang around 14 billion years ago. of material stuff which God created, but not God Himself, who is non-material. Merely "showing up" for the debate he loses! This means it contains EVERYTHING (and therefore every person) that exists.". But even the sun will run out of energy some day — as is the same with every star.